ROTF nominated for a Saturn Award

[JediTricks]

It's true. Check out the news here: http://www.tfviews.com/news/entertainment/782
"Best Science Fiction Film" category, that's the big one, folks! I know, I can't believe it either. The competition isn't even that stiff, the other nominees are mostly pap:
* The Book of Eli
* Knowing
* Moon
* Star Trek
* Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen
* X-Men Origins: Wolverine

Avatar isn't even in this category, they put it in "Fantasy" I think merely to assure more popular winners.

[Dominic]

There is so little difference between sci-fi and fantasy that I would argue that having two categories is a question of maintaining a distinction without meaningful difference.

And, I would think "Knowing" would be more at home in the fantasy category.

Dom
-betting it will come down to TF and Trek.

[donosaur]

As far as true Sci Fi, isn't Moon supposed to be really good? It won't win, just saying though, it's more dedicated to being science fiction

[Sparky Prime]

There is so little difference between sci-fi and fantasy that I would argue that having two categories is a question of maintaining a distinction without meaningful difference.

In a sci-fi literature course I took in college, our first discussion board question was essentially "How do you define what is sci-fi"? It's surprisingly difficult to define but there is still a meaningful difference between it and fantasy, being that sci-fi's imaginary elements are largely possible through scientifically established/postulated laws.

That said, I'm surprised Avatar isn't in the sci-fi category as well.

I'm thinking Star Trek will come out on top of the movies listed here.

[Dominic]

But, by the same token, much of what we consider to be technology would have been considered magic/super-science in the past.

Hard scifi and fantasy are easy to distinguish from each other. But, regular/soft scifi is essentially fantasy with a different look.

(Planets become islands. Lasers become spells. X becomes Y.)

Dom
-and Warhammers just blends them without blinking.

[138 Scourge]

As far as true Sci Fi, isn't Moon supposed to be really good? It won't win, just saying though, it's more dedicated to being science fiction

I really liked Moon. It had a sort of Twilight Zone kind of vibe to it. Through most of it, anyway.

Wow, I only saw that, Star Trek, and ROTF. I fail at science fictioning.

[Sparky Prime]

But, by the same token, much of what we consider to be technology would have been considered magic/super-science in the past.

I didn't say anything about technology... I said sci-fi is largely explained by elements of science. In that respect, it doesn't matter if something might have been considered magic/super-science once upon a time, the point is that it's something explained to be made possible by (somewhat) realistic laws of nature rather than something unexplainable, like magic.

But again, I did say sci-fi is difficult to define. There are some genre's of science fiction that incorporates both science and magic for example (such as some comics books), making it more difficult to place it specifically into fantasy or sci-fi.

[JediTricks]

There is so little difference between sci-fi and fantasy that I would argue that having two categories is a question of maintaining a distinction without meaningful difference.

I think judging the nominees this year, there's no meaningful difference between the Saturns and the Golden Globes.

As far as true Sci Fi, isn't Moon supposed to be really good? It won't win, just saying though, it's more dedicated to being science fiction

I have heard it's really good like that, but I haven't checked it out yet.

But, by the same token, much of what we consider to be technology would have been considered magic/super-science in the past.

Hard scifi and fantasy are easy to distinguish from each other. But, regular/soft scifi is essentially fantasy with a different look.

(Planets become islands. Lasers become spells. X becomes Y.)

Dom
-and Warhammers just blends them without blinking.

Fantasy is where there's no intention of possible reason beyond how that universe works, things exist purely at the whim of the author for their own merits with no expectation of the audience to understand it beyond the concept of "magic". Sauron is a giant eyeball because magic is cool and he's a powerful badass, not because his non-corporeal form was transferred to a forcefield atop a powerful generating tower. There's no attempt to explain the concept behind how the One Ring works in either a passive or active manner, it just does what it does because that's the way the story goes.

Star Wars may be sci-fi-lite, but it's still got automatons, interstellar travel through spaceships, even the concept behind lightsabers has a limited plausibility; technology may be used sloppily but there's some underlying attempt to use it. Shit, if anything, Transformers is the one that should be Fantasy, there's no attempt to explain how the Allspark brings these bots to life, they have tech-based bodies but not because they were built that way, not because they evolved that way.

[Dominic]

The more loosely defined technology is in a given story, the more "magical" it becomes.

his non-corporeal form was transferred to a forcefield atop a powerful generating tower

So, uh, that is magic right?

I am not against the use of magic, (or sort-of science), in fiction. I am just arguing that there is little meaningful difference between the genres.

TF is a good, if extreme, example of how some science fiction is so ungrounded in physics that it is effectively about magic. The harder the scifi, the less it deviates from established science or reasonable extensions of it. "Star Wars" and "Transformers" are in no way hard scifi.

Dom

[Sparky Prime]

I am just arguing that there is little meaningful difference between the genres.

And as I already pointed out, there is a very meaningful difference. How a piece of technology isn't necessarily going to be explained within a story. This doesn't make it more "magical" though, as within context of the story it is still understood to be something governed by the scientific laws of nature.