Sentinel,is releasing a Titan sized Scorponok in 2014.

[Sparky Prime]

You are still wrong & I am still right. per all the examples I gave in this thread. Mattel,Matchbox,Hasbro & mcdonalds are not considered 3rd party companies when they ask for permission & pay a license fee to create+sell other companies merchandise.

You're still under the impression that a 3rd party product automatically means it isn't legal, so no you aren't. None of the examples you've posted are proof of anything since all you've done is claim they aren't 3rd party products. Anyone can make a claim anything either is or isn't something, so where is your evidence to actually support that? Cite something to back up a claim for once.

days ago,I did look up the term 3rd party on several wiki & definations sites. So I know hundreds of possible different definations.

And as I'd told you, that definition you'd posted was an example of a 3rd party in law. It doesn't really pertain to anything we're discussing here. And even if it did, you never said how.

You are confusing the toy market with the electronics market in regards to 3rd party products/companies,both function different.

No, it's pretty much the same thing. Both markets have licensed and unlicensed 3rd party products. You're saying this just because I cited Apple? That's not even all electronics products you know, right?

The toy market is vastly different than the electronics market. You obviously do not know all the definations of what a 3rd party/unofficial is because you incorrectly labeled the "Sentinel" company/products. Sentinel does things the legal way they ask permission & pay license fees. most electronics companies who try to substitue other companies computer or gaming accessories do no ask permission no do the pay any license fees.

You're obviously not reading anything I've posted. A 3rd party product can be officially licensed. You're completely confusing the entire issue simply by not understanding that one point.

The main reasons why all these 3rd party not-TF companies all got the defination 3rd party,was due to most of them in the pioneer/first few years all making add-on accessories/weapons/gear to compliment existing other companies licensed figures toys.

That's a load of bull. As I continue to point out, a 3rd party is simply another company that produces a product. It's not any more specific than that. It makes zero difference if it's an add-on or something like an entire action figure.

Personally,I'd take the definations/terms from internet import sites before I take terms/definations from internet fans.

So then why are you ignoring how Apple's website defines a 3rd party product?

[Tigermegatron]

You are still wrong & I am still right. per all the examples I gave in this thread. Mattel,Matchbox,Hasbro & mcdonalds are not considered 3rd party companies when they ask for permission & pay a license fee to create+sell other companies merchandise.

Those examples aren't proof of anything. Anyone can post a claim that something either is or isn't something. Where is your evidence? Cite something to actually back up a claim for once.

days ago,I did look up the term 3rd party on several wiki & definations sites. So I know hundreds of possible different definations.

And as I'd told you, that definition you'd posted was an example of a 3rd party in law. It doesn't really pertain to anything we're discussing here. And even if it did, you never said how.

You are confusing the toy market with the electronics market in regards to 3rd party products/companies,both function different.

No, it's pretty much the same thing. Both markets have licensed and unlicensed 3rd party products. You're saying this just because I cited Apple? That's not all electronics you know, right?

The toy market is vastly different than the electronics market. You obviously do not know all the definations of what a 3rd party/unofficial is because you incorrectly labeled the "Sentinel" company/products. Sentinel does things the legal way they ask permission & pay license fees. most electronics companies who try to substitue other companies computer or gaming accessories do no ask permission no do the pay any license fees.

You're obviously not reading anything I've posted. A 3rd party product can be officially licensed. You're completely confusing the issue simply by not understanding that one point.

The main reasons why all these 3rd party not-TF companies all got the defination 3rd party,was due to most of them in the pioneer/first few years all making add-on accessories/weapons/gear to compliment existing other companies licensed figures toys.

Frankly, that's a load of bull. A 3rd party is simply another company that produces a product. It's not any more specific than that.

Personally,I'd take the definations/terms from internet import sites before I take terms/definations from internet fans.

And that's why you're ignoring how Apple's website defines a 3rd party product?

You've given so many replies in this thread but you didn't give the main one,which was your actual opinion on what you thought of the toy. do you like it? dislike it? was it too big? too small? too exspensive? was the design great or awful.

Honestly all you really seem to care about in this thread is nitpicking what I say & trying to insist I am wrong.

You seem very careful in this thread not to give any of your opinions. you have not given any personal opinion on the toy nor did you bother to give any opinion on any of the examples I gave. Instead you cleverly steered away from this & kept throwing out facts which you have no personal opinion for.

You carefully sterred away from giving a personal opinion on what you think of the following companies when they acquire temp licenses from other companies characters to release themed toys like what Matttel,mcdonalds,matchbox,cms corps,Device label,Hasbro,Disney cross-over TF toys does. Do you consider these companies 3rd party or there products 3rd party when they they pay other companies license fees & ask permission to release other companies characters as products?

When I gave the ultimate example,which was BBTS,TFScource,toyarena,Captured prey Does not list Sentinel,CMS Corps,Device label,disney cross-overs toys in the 3rd party sections on there import sites. You cleverly steered away from this,didn't include it in your above reply & gave no personal opinion on this.

In closing,I could care less what fans label stuff. All I care about is what official companies & credited internet import selling sites label stuff. The sheer fact the company sentinel nor it products are not listed in the 3rd party section on there sites means these import sites don't consider these companies+products as 3rd party stuff.

Had CMS Corps,Sentinel,Disney TF crossovers toys,Device label been considered 3rd party companies that sell 3rd party products. Various top rated TF news sites with forums like Seibertron,TFormers,allspark,TFW2005,Would have listed these companies up for discussion on there "3rd party" sub section on there forums. Since this didn't happen,this means these sites/forums DO NOT CONSIDER these companies+there products as 3rd party. You can provide all the "so called" facts you want. if the majority like the TF sites with forums & import selling sites doesn't support your facts then they are fruitless.

[Sparky Prime]

You've given so many replies in this thread but you didn't give the main one,which was your actual opinion on what you thought of the toy. do you like it? dislike it? was it too big? too small? too exspensive? was the design great or awful.

Honestly all you really seem to care about in this thread is nitpicking what I say & trying to insist I am wrong.

You seem very careful in this thread not to give any of your opinions. you have not given any personal opinion on the toy nor did you bother to give any opinion on any of the examples I gave. Instead you cleverly steered away from this & kept throwing out facts which you have no personal opinion for.

No, I have expressed some criticism about the figure. You don't remember how we got onto this discussion in the first place? I was talking about why it doesn't transform and the high cost of it probably being the result of having been produced by another company rather than Takara-Tomy. If Takara-Tomy had made it themselves instead, don't you think it would be able to transform, and have a lower cost? That's my criticism of the figure. I think it would have been a better figure (meaning being able to transform and have a more reasonable price) if Takara-Tomy had made it themselves instead of another company.

When I gave the ultimate example,which was BBTS,TFScource,toyarena,Captured prey Does not list Sentinel,CMS Corps,Device label,disney cross-overs toys in the 3rd party sections on there import sites. You cleverly steered away from this,didn't include it in your above reply & gave no personal opinion on this.

From the wall of text you posted? I didn't feel like everything was worth commenting on since a lot of it goes without saying. But since you seem to want it to be said... Those are all 3rd party licensed products, so they belong with the other Transformers products, but yet, they are sub-categorized by those companies for that reason. Where as 3rd party unlicensed products have to be distinctive from the Transformers brand and so would have to be listed in a completely separate category as a result. Honestly, it's not so complicated as you're making it out to be...

Had CMS Corps,Sentinel,Disney TF crossovers toys,Device label been considered 3rd party companies that sell 3rd party products. Various top rated TF news sites with forums like Seibertron,TFormers,allspark,TFW2005,Would have listed these companies up for discussion on there "3rd party" sub section on there forums. Since this didn't happen,this means these sites/forums DO NOT CONSIDER these companies+there products as 3rd party. You can provide all the "so called" facts you want. if the majority like the TF sites with forums & import selling sites doesn't support them they are fruitless.

You might want to double check your "facts" here. How fan sites sort their information isn't really a credible source for such things. But even then, there is more to how those sites categorize that information than you seem to realize or want to admit. For example, the full name of the TFW2005 3rd party section is actually "3rd Party Unlicensed". Which is somewhat simplified on the forums since there really isn't a need for 3rd party licensed figures to have it's own category like that. There is a much, much smaller volume of 3rd party licensed products those sites typically report on that it's unnecessary.

[Tigermegatron]

You've given so many replies in this thread but you didn't give the main one,which was your actual opinion on what you thought of the toy. do you like it? dislike it? was it too big? too small? too exspensive? was the design great or awful.

Honestly all you really seem to care about in this thread is nitpicking what I say & trying to insist I am wrong.

You seem very careful in this thread not to give any of your opinions. you have not given any personal opinion on the toy nor did you bother to give any opinion on any of the examples I gave. Instead you cleverly steered away from this & kept throwing out facts which you have no personal opinion for.

No, I have expressed some criticism about the figure. You don't remember how we got onto this discussion in the first place? I was talking about why it doesn't transform and the high cost of it probably being the result of having been produced by another company rather than Takara-Tomy. If Takara-Tomy had made it themselves instead, don't you think it would be able to transform, and have a lower cost? That's my criticism of the figure. I think it would have been a better figure (meaning being able to transform and have a more reasonable price) if Takara-Tomy had made it themselves instead of another company.

When I gave the ultimate example,which was BBTS,TFScource,toyarena,Captured prey Does not list Sentinel,CMS Corps,Device label,disney cross-overs toys in the 3rd party sections on there import sites. You cleverly steered away from this,didn't include it in your above reply & gave no personal opinion on this.

From the wall of text you posted? I didn't feel like everything was worth commenting on since a lot of it goes without saying. But since you seem to want it to be said... Those are all 3rd party licensed products, so they belong with the other Transformers products, but yet, they are sub-categorized by those companies for that reason. Where as 3rd party unlicensed products have to be distinctive from the Transformers brand and so would have to be listed in a completely separate category as a result. Honestly, it's not so complicated as you're making it out to be...

Had CMS Corps,Sentinel,Disney TF crossovers toys,Device label been considered 3rd party companies that sell 3rd party products. Various top rated TF news sites with forums like Seibertron,TFormers,allspark,TFW2005,Would have listed these companies up for discussion on there "3rd party" sub section on there forums. Since this didn't happen,this means these sites/forums DO NOT CONSIDER these companies+there products as 3rd party. You can provide all the "so called" facts you want. if the majority like the TF sites with forums & import selling sites doesn't support them they are fruitless.

You might want to double check your "facts" here. How fan sites sort their information isn't really a credible source for such things. But even then, there is more to how those sites categorize that information than you seem to realize or want to admit. For example, the full name of the TFW2005 3rd party section is actually "3rd Party Unlicensed". Which is somewhat simplified on the forums since there really isn't a need for 3rd party licensed figures to have it's own category like that. There is a much, much smaller volume of 3rd party licensed products those sites typically report on that it's unnecessary.

BBTS,Captured Prey,TFScource,toyarena don't have a licensed 3rd party toy section on there import sites because the term LICENSED 3rd party companies/toys does NOT EXIST.

CMS Corps,Device labels,Sentinel & Disney TF cross-overs companies/toys are listed in the official companies sections on import sites because they have earned the right to be there,by obeying all the rules,asking permission & paying license fees. NOT BECAUSE THERE ISN'T ANY LICENSED 3RD PARTY SECTIONS DUE THE COMPANIES/PRODUCTS BEING TO FEW IN NUMBER TO BOTHER CREATING A SECTION FOR.

TF sites with forums like,the allspark,seibertron,tformers,tfw2005,decribe 3rd party TF toys as unlicensed because thats what they are. since these companies did not ask permission nor pay any license fees. it's more or less a warning to potential fans-buyers who are younger & more naieve. If MMC or fanprojects were to ask permission & pay Hasbro a license fee,they would no longer be considered 3rd party companies that create 3rd party product & there newer products would be listed on the regular TF sections not on the 3rd party sections.

If you are ready to be proven right or wrong,here's an idea for you. send a few emails to bbts,captured prey,tfsource,toyarena & ask them if sentinel,cms corps,device label,disney TF cross overs toys are considered 3rd party or official companies/products. also ask them if there is such a thing as licensed 3rd party toys & unlicensed 3rd party toys,tell them you consider cms,device label,sentinel,disney TF cross-overs as licensed 3rd party companies/products,ask them if you are using the correct terms or not. while you at it you can email a few top rated TF sites with forums & ask them the same exact questions you asked the various import sites.

[Sparky Prime]

BBTS,Captured Prey,TFScource,toyarena don't have a licensed 3rd party toy section on there import sites because the term licensed 3rd party companies/toys does NOT EXIST.

That's simply not true. Licensed 3rd parties and is a real term and certainly does exist. Seriously do a google search for "licensed 3rd party" and you'll find a ton of results. Here, in fact, let me do some of the work for you... again. I found a page from none other than Hasbro which makes this statement: "Most of Hasbro’s toy products are manufactured by third-party vendors and under license".

TF sites with forums like,the allspark,seibertron,tformers,tfw2005,decribe 3rd party TF toys as unlicensed because thats what they are. since these companies did not ask permission nor pay any license fees. it's more or less a warning to potential fans-buyers who are younger & more naieve. If MMC or fanprojects were to ask permission & pay Hasbro a license fee,they would no longer be considered 3rd party companies that create 3rd party product & there newer products would be listed on the regular TF sections not on the 3rd party sections.

Yes, they have an unlicensed 3rd party section because those are what those products are, unlicensed 3rd party products. And there are a lot of them. But it's really unnecessary for them to have a licensed 3rd party section. I do want to point out mis-communicating something in my previous post here though, when I said the volume of licensed 3rd parties products is much smaller, what I meant there is we don't see that many other companies getting licensing for Transformers action figures like this, since the vast majority are manufactured by Takara. They're grouped together since they are all officially licensed products, but they are sub-categorized by company for a reason. Anyway to the point of if a company like FanProject had licensing from Hasbro, no, they would still be considered a 3rd party to Hasbro, since Hasbro wasn't the company to make that product. Again, all a "3rd party" basically means is that it's a different company that made that product. It doesn't automatically mean it isn't a licensed product. I don't understand why you're still stuck on that.

If you are ready to be proven right or wrong,here's an idea for you. send a few emails to bbts,captured prey,tfsource,toyarena & ask them if sentinel,cms corps,device label,disney TF cross overs toys are considered 3rd party or official companies/products.

There's an idea. Or hey, better yet, you could just do a little bit of research for yourself instead, since it's all online already. Like the above statement from Hasbro. Or the Apple support page I linked to. Or any number of resources that all say the same thing.

[Tigermegatron]

That's simply not true. Licensed 3rd parties and is a real term and certainly does exist. Seriously do a google search for "licensed 3rd party" and you'll find a ton of results. Here, in fact, let me do some of the work for you... again. I found a page from none other than Hasbro which makes this statement: "Most of Hasbro’s toy products are manufactured by third-party vendors and under license".

This is a polite way to say,"None of Hasbro's products are made in the USA. Instead all of Hasbro's Products are made in manufactoring plants overseas."

this is not saying Hasbro is a licensed 3rd party company that creates licensed 3rd party products.

the problem here,is a reading comprehension problem.

Yes, they have an unlicensed 3rd party section because those are what those products are, unlicensed 3rd party products. And there are a lot of them. But it's really unnecessary for them to have a licensed 3rd party section. I do want to point out mis-communicating something in my previous post here though, when I said the volume of licensed 3rd parties products is much smaller, what I meant there is we don't see that many other companies getting licensing for Transformers action figures like this, since the vast majority are manufactured by Takara. They're grouped together since they are all officially licensed products, but they are sub-categorized by company for a reason. Anyway to the point of if a company like FanProject had licensing from Hasbro, no, they would still be considered a 3rd party to Hasbro, since Hasbro wasn't the company to make that product. Again, all a "3rd party" basically means is that it's a different company that made that product. It doesn't automatically mean it isn't a licensed product. I don't understand why you're still stuck on that.

You are making guesses/assumptions about these TF news site with forums,these import sites & these companies. if you want to be proven right or wrong,then send a few emails there way & ask them some detailed questions.

You can't just go around creating non-sense made up terms & expect the fans or companies not to get offended by them. I am sure Hasbro would take offense & be upset to hear the media or fans calling them a liscensed 3rd party company that creates licensed 3rd party products. especially considering Hasbro's ever growing hate for 3rd party companies like MMC,FP,TW,etc..

You need to understand there is no such term as "Licensed 3rd party companies that creates licensed 3rd party products." you mis-read all the 3rd party definations & came up with a wrong defination term. you need to accept that if a company does things the legal way by obeying the laws,asking permission & paying license fees then they have more than earned the right to be recognized as official companies that create official products.

CMS Corps,Sentinel,Device label,Disney TF cross overs toys are not considered liscensed 3rd party companies that create liscense 3rd party products. Because these companies have not listed themselves by this term,they list there companies as official. import selling sites have not listed them with this term,they list them in the official section. TF News sites with forums have not listed them with this term,they list them in the official section.

Sparky,You are dis-respecting & insulting Sentinel & it's products by calling them fan made up/self imposed terms that would be deemed a insult & incorrect to what this company has listed itself as,which is official. to sugar coat the "official" term by maybe adding perhaps it's a official liscensed 3rd party company that releases official licensed 3rd party products would be deemed a even bigger insult & more wrong term to oppose on this company.

Sentinel & CMS Corps buying the license rights to create other companies characters via new toy molds. Is no different than what Hasbro does,when they pay license fees to marvel to create+release all those Marvel movie theatre toy lines. Hasbro doesn't ever call itself a liscensed 3rd party company that releases licensed 3rd party marvel toy lines,nor do the import sites nor do TF news sites with forums coin this term.

[Sparky Prime]

This is a polite way to say,"None of Hasbro's products are made in the USA. Instead all of Hasbro's Products are made in manufactoring plants overseas."

this is not saying Hasbro is a licensed 3rd party company that creates licensed 3rd party products.

What? It's exactly what it says it is. It really doesn't get any clearer than that. Why would you even think that they need to be polite about something being made over seas? This is an official company outline from Hasbro itself, there is absolutely no reason to doubt anything in their meaning like that. Although you're right that it isn't saying Hasbro is the 3rd party, it's saying the companies that manufacture the toys are the 3rd party. In other words, that's literally saying Takara-Tomy is a licensed 3rd party to Hasbro.

the problem here,is a reading comprehension problem.

There's a problem with reading here alright, but it's not just with comprehension.

You are making guesses/assumptions about these TF news site with forums,these import sites & these companies. if you want to be proven right or wrong,then send a few emails there way & ask them some detailed questions.

I'm not making an assumption at all. I've already posted at least 2 links from 2 different official companies saying exactly what a 3rd party is. The places that sell those products would have to categorize them accordingly. I've already done the research to back up what I've said here. Where is your proof if you want to prove or disprove it? You're the only one guessing here, since you haven't offered anything that actually backs up your claims. If you want to disprove, that's on you to do a little research for yourself.

You can't just go around creating non-sense made up terms & expect the fans or companies not to get offended by them. I am sure Hasbro would take offense & be upset to hear the media or fans calling them a liscensed 3rd party company that creates licensed 3rd party products. especially considering Hasbro's ever growing hate for 3rd party companies like MMC,FP,TW,etc..

You realize even though you tried to dismiss it, Hasbro actually said it themselves, right? I mean, going back to what you said above... How exactly is that a "polite" way to say "made over seas"? If what you're saying here were true, that'd be more of an insult in their own official statement, wouldn't it? Except it isn't because it's not made up, nor is it insulting to those companies. It's a real part of a lot of business. Not sure how you can deny that at this point when it should be clear to you that even these companies use that terminology. You're the only one that's misunderstanding it, or otherwise refusing to.

you need to accept that if a company does things the legal way by obeying the laws,asking permission & paying license fees then they have more than earned the right to be recognized as official companies that create official products.

I already know that to be true. The problem here is that you need to accept that the two are not mutually exclusive, that something can be 3rd party and licensed.

[Almighty Unicron]

Well ignoring the fact that Tigermegatron is acting like a child- I can't be the only one who's surprised this guy doesn't transform. Scorponok has such a simple transformation. It's a question of rotating his shoulders up and bending forward at the knee. They seriously couldn't have engineered that?

[Tigermegatron]

I'm done replying here.

[Tigermegatron]

Thread update: BBTS has updated there order listing for this product. http://www.bigbadtoystore.com/bbts/prod ... ode=retail

BBTS,has removed this product from there from page. When you click on a old saved link,it says "VOID & Back ordered" it also list this item for $0.00.

My guess is BBTS did this because hardly anyone or maybe nobody was ordering this.