Dark Cybertron

The IDW Comics universe has had such a different take on G1, one that's now significantly represented by the Generations toys, so they share a forum. A modern take on a Real Cybertronian Hero. Currently starring Generations toys, IDW "The Transformers" comics, MTMTE, TF vs GI Joe, and Windblade.
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Sparky Prime
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Re: Dark Cybertron

Post by Sparky Prime »

Dominic wrote:McCarthy's run was a soft reboot. "Dark Cybertron" and "Chaos" are more event stories.

A soft reboot means that the established continuity is maintained though, it doesn't excuse it at all from any backwriting changes anymore than an event storyline.

The rewrites also seem to be coming more frequently, even putting aside questions of relative severity.

Again, I wouldn't agree that they are really rewriting anything here. Most of this stuff was already established way back when Furman was still writing for the series as well as subsequent writers long before Roberts and Barber took over.

Call me crazy, but I tend to think that getting zapped in to another dimension should be a more permanent thing, rather than only being slightly more inconvenient than missing one's stop on the bus.

When has being zapped into another dimension ever been a permanent thing in anything? Usually everyone is back where they belong by the end of that story. If not, they usually come back sooner or later. And it is more inconvenient than missing a bus. Nightbeat has been there since the end of Furman's run, about 5-6 years ago.

If Nightbeat comes back fully re-alived, then none of his previous adventures have had any practical impact. Similarly, who cares if Optimus Prime took a vacation and started using his old name if he is back leading the Autobots as Prime now? These are the kinds of "back to stasis quo" resets that I dislike so much from the big 2. I have learned to live with it there. But, I am not likely to be so forgiving of it in TF, if only because I have grown used to TF avoiding that kind of thing.

Why wouldn't any of Nightbeat's previous adventures have any practical impact if he's alive again? The only reason he had Hardhead kill him in the first place was because he saw it as the only way, at the time, to prevent Nova Prime from taking control of him. I don't see that his death had any impact with his previous adventures, so what difference would his return make?
And with Optimus, clearly he needed time to gain some perspective and figure out where he fit in with a post-war Cybertron. But even with his return to the name Optimus Prime and position as leader of the Autobots, that doesn't mean it's back to the status quo. The war is still over. And as we've seen, Megatron is not returning to lead the Decepticons. There's apparently going to be some other reason for the Autobots to return to Earth. It's by far not a reset.

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Re: Dark Cybertron

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Chapter 8:

Fembots. After all the Windblade controversy, I can't say I'm all that thrilled that the issue of gender and Transformers is now front and center. We'll see how it's handled in the books themselves, and I'll try to ignore the obnoxious bits of fandom. At least I can count on decent discussion here, thankfully, if it's necessary.

So the book is still multiple running plotlines. It defies summary, because nothing really starts and nothing reaches a conclusion. Still. After 8 chapters. There are some good character moments, and Kup is back, which is a good thing since the character was given the indignity of being written out that awful zombie crossover.

Do I think Optimus Prime will beat Nova Prime? It's only chapter 8... probably not. But I may be surprised.

The biggest disappointment: the whole plotline involving Starscream's leadership looks like it's been short circuited. If so, it's a wasted opportunity.

It was nice seeing Bumblebee slap down Megatron, verbally at least.

On to chapter 9. This is going to be a story where its value (to me at least) will be in what it accomplishes. It's been reasonably entertaining, but there's just too much going on and too little resolved. I keep saying that same thing, but I can't think of much else. As Dom says, it's a "stuff what happens" plot. Not without merit, but not what I might have hoped.

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Re: Dark Cybertron

Post by JediTricks »

Sparky Prime wrote:It'll be set in the current timeline. The preview character art they've shown for the comic has Starscream in his current Armada body and solicitations reference it taking place after the events of Dark Cybertron. And Cybertron isn't uninhabitable. It's just been reset to a primordial state, making it somewhat dangerous to live outside of Iacon. At this point, Windblade is only going to be a 4 issue mini-series, but if it does well they could make it an ongoing.
Cybertron is uninhabitable, the planet attacks bots the further from Iacon they get, there are energy blasts or something IIRC, and the mental attacks thing.

4 ish miniseries huh? I guess they're hoping Dark Cybertron will bring in new readers who might want to try more, thus striking while the iron is hot.


Dominic wrote:
If the stuff what was happening was compelling, we'd want to talk about it.
Point by point summaries are tedious as hell.
This series is tedious as hell. Nobody seems terribly excited at this point, it's a slog, and the story isn't lighting any imaginations aflame.

All of Transformers is a back-write and fix, look at the first Marvel issues and the first Sunbow cartoon 5-parter, there's plenty of fixing going on from that foundation material.
Uh, how so?
Don't be intentional dense, it's unbecoming.

or they could released a purpose made comic (to show those guys and maybe explain their Earth modes), or.....
Well, obviously they're not going to do that, it'd cost more. But still, they already had better material.

Just imagine a kid getting the Minicon set, and then getting the Whirl toy.
I'll have to, I strongly doubt any kids... or ANYBODY... is going to get most of these Generations figures. Fucking Hasbro needs to get their shit together and make product AVAILABLE.


Sparky wrote:
Call me crazy, but I tend to think that getting zapped in to another dimension should be a more permanent thing, rather than only being slightly more inconvenient than missing one's stop on the bus.
When has being zapped into another dimension ever been a permanent thing in anything? Usually everyone is back where they belong by the end of that story. If not, they usually come back sooner or later. And it is more inconvenient than missing a bus. Nightbeat has been there since the end of Furman's run, about 5-6 years ago.
To be fair, we're told over and over that this is where people are taken to die, where the universe itself attacks them TO DEATH, dead dead deadity dead dead. It's in the place's name. Maybe that name is incomplete, maybe it's really "the 'Comic Book-Dead' Universe", then it'd make perfect sense.


Anderson wrote:The biggest disappointment: the whole plotline involving Starscream's leadership looks like it's been short circuited. If so, it's a wasted opportunity.
I hate that so much!!! That was one of the most interesting things they could have explored, had they explored it intelligently. Instead it just disintegrated to make way for BIG COMIC BOOK EVENT.

I should probably hit the comic shop today and pick up my pull list.
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Sparky Prime
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Re: Dark Cybertron

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JediTricks wrote:Cybertron is uninhabitable, the planet attacks bots the further from Iacon they get, there are energy blasts or something IIRC, and the mental attacks thing.

The planet being primordial and wild is not the same thing as being uninhabitable. Cybertron is habital, it's just dangerous outside of Iacon. Yet there are a few who have been surviving outside the city. And they have already put an end to some of that. The energy blast thing for example was the result of energy being sent from Cybertron to a moon that's no longer there. Wheeljack figured that out and put a stop to it.

To be fair, we're told over and over that this is where people are taken to die, where the universe itself attacks them TO DEATH, dead dead deadity dead dead. It's in the place's name. Maybe that name is incomplete, maybe it's really "the 'Comic Book-Dead' Universe", then it'd make perfect sense.

We've also been told since the concept was introduced that it's a backwards bizzaro universe where the dead are not dead. The dead universe kills them to make them a part of it rather than of the living universe.

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Re: Dark Cybertron

Post by Dominic »

Don't be intentional dense, it's unbecoming.


Seriously, explain your comment. The original Marvel series had two significant back-writes.

-the Matrix: Around US issue 60, when Furman brought the Matrix in to the comic, he made it more consistent with the UK comics and the cartoons. This required readers to assume that the Autobots never checked Prime's corpse for an all-important McGuffin that they all should have known he was carrying around in his chest. And, it assumed that the Decepticons never claimed the Matrix when they had Prime' components on hand circa issue 8.

-Megatron's survival: When Budiansky killed Megatron off in issue 25, he had no intention of Megatron ever coming back. However, Furman used Megatron for several years in the UK before taking over the US comic. When consolidating and streamlining, Furman re-introduced Megatron in the US comic and back-wrote all kinds of shit to make it work.

A back-write is when something is undone or revealed to have somehow not happened as shown despite the fact that the original writer never intended for the reveal to apply. For example, nobody thinks that Marvel planned for 1950s Captain America and Bucky to be revealed as imposters filling in for the originals. When that was "revealed" in the 1970s, it was a back-write. But, when Booster Gold seemed to died in "52", it was planned for his death to be revealed as a fake-out.

For the most part, TF has been a linear story (aside from when the license changes hands). Generally, even allowing for sloppy mistakes, when something happened, it was not undone or "big revealed to have not happened".


I hate that so much!!! That was one of the most interesting things they could have explored, had they explored it intelligently. Instead it just disintegrated to make way for BIG COMIC BOOK EVENT.


I partly agree. But, we need to wait and see. From what we have seen, Barber is not done with Prowl. He may still have plans for Starscream after "Dark Cybertron".




The iTunes preview for the next chapter of Dark Cybertron has Shockwave [spoiler]planning to drain the Dead Universe's energy from the dawn of its creation. Essentially explaining why it was a Dead Universe from it's inception.[/spoiler]



Well, he can rule out one possible ending for "Re-Generation One".

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Re: Dark Cybertron part 10 (More than Meets the Eye #27)

Post by Dominic »

I was considering editing my last post to include this review. But, for the sake of keeping this thread (relatively streamlined, it is probably better to write a new post.


Dark Cybertron part 10 (More than Meets the Eye #27):

This is the promised breather issue. The only characters in immediate danger are Prime and the other guys trapped in the Dead Universe. (Every time I type "Dead Universe", I feel a little stupider. Anybody else having that problem?) Oddly, nobody seems overly concerned about them.

Most of Prowl's page-time is spent following up on his antics since the end of "All Hail Megatron". Nobody has called out Prowl about what happened with Kup. But, aside from Perceptor, nobody seems to know much about it. (And, if Kup makes it back from the Dead Universe, it is a pretty safe bet that it will not be good news for Prowl.) Prowl ends up spending time answering to Magnus and contending with the fact that the Constructicons genuinely seem to like him. Prowl's scenes give me hope for post-"Dark Cybertron" TF comics.

Megatron's upcoming face-turn is pretty aggressively telegraphed. (Even without the preview image, it would be all but impossible not to see it coming.) The biggest question now is how IDW will explain Megatron having an Autobot sigil.

Shockwave's plan comes across like something I would expect from a 70s Marvel cosmic bad guy. It is an eclectic mix of vague pseudo-science and nonsensical megalomania.

The art is better than in previous issues. But, Ironhide is way the hell too big in a crowd scene at the beginning.

From a marketing perspective, this issue is an absolute mess. If the cover gallery is anything to go by, this is going to be the issue packaged with the upcoming Skybite figure. I had to go back and *look* for Skybite. (He is in one crowd-scene, sitting in Swerve's new bar.) Meanwhile Arcee gets a shiny new body, and the obligatory show-off/intro scene. And, the Minicon/Ammonite combiner actually shows up clearly (albeit as part of an attacking mob).


Grade C




Next issue might be the thing that decides if I stick with TF post "Dark Cybertron".

The previews and solicits promise that somebody is going to die. It is either going to be Bumblebee, Rodimus, Magnus or Prowl.

We can rule out Bumblebee. Call me crazy, but I am not anticipating IDW killing off Hasbro's yellow cash-cow.

Rodimus and Magnus are possibilities. Both characters have more or less resolved their arcs at this point, and killing them is probably the only move that the writers could make at this point.

Additionally, Magnus' death was predicted during the Necrobot's appearance in issue 8 of "More than Meets the Eye" and it would provide a time reference/jump that TF is about due for. Magnus' death would be decisive. It would serve a purpose.


But, if IDW kills off Prowl, then.... That would probably be a clear indication that IDW was abandoning Prowl's "grey area" angle. It might even signal that IDW's TF comics were losing direction.

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Re: Dark Cybertron

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At this point, if they kill off "Magnus", it's not going to bother me, since he's not Magnus and the person wearing the armor has died and passed it on many times before. It's just the way it goes for the Magnuses of the IDW universe, apparently. Frankly, I'll be glad to be rid of him at this point (which is a turnaround from pre-"Stay in Light" issues).

I got the issue today but haven't had time to read it yet. Dark Cybertron feels like a bust to me. It derailed some good storylines in RID, and has taken twice as many issues as it needed to tell the story. I'll be glad to get past it. Maybe the last few chapters will change my mind. I'd like to think so. A good payoff might just make the storyline worth it.

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Re: Dark Cybertron part 10 (More than Meets the Eye #27)

Post by Shockwave »

Dominic wrote:(Every time I type "Dead Universe", I feel a little stupider. Anybody else having that problem?)


I feel stupider for having read it.

Also, I fully expect that by the time IDW's run with TF is over, Optimus Prime will revert to Optimus Pax and Orion Prime.

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Re: Dark Cybertron part 10 (More than Meets the Eye #27)

Post by JediTricks »

Finally picked up 8-10 and read them last night. Unfortunately they misfire horribly, first in art - what a visual mess - then in story which just degrades into a series of deus ex machinas and slugfests. Every ounce of promise is drained of this mess as Shockwave's big plan is finally revealed and it's stupider than stupid, but at least Optimus Prime got his groove back and all it took was a pep talk to beat his ultimate evil. That shit straight sucked. The best thing I can say is there was one panel where Kup looked like Kup, then it went back to not looking like Kup.

Dominic wrote:This is the promised breather issue. The only characters in immediate danger are Prime and the other guys trapped in the Dead Universe. (Every time I type "Dead Universe", I feel a little stupider. Anybody else having that problem?) Oddly, nobody seems overly concerned about them.
Well, to be fair, the Dead Universe is now EVEN STUPIDER THAN IT WAS BEFORE, the explanation given in this issue is really awful too.

Nobody is concerned in issue 10 with ANYTHING, it seems. Let's go back to the bar and sing songs. Let's stand around talking while the world crumbles and deadly mysteries awash everything. Hey look roboboobs. Seriously? So it's not surprising that OP and Roddy's trip to the DU is unimportant to the rest of our heroes, they are too busy getting giant thumbs out of giant asses.

The art is better than in previous issues. But, Ironhide is way the hell too big in a crowd scene at the beginning.
You oversold that in earlier messages, he looks totally in scale with Arcee just in front of him, and there's nothing around him that's really throwing off his scale terribly except Soundwave, who has gotten smaller and smaller as this series has continued.

From a marketing perspective, this issue is an absolute mess. If the cover gallery is anything to go by, this is going to be the issue packaged with the upcoming Skybite figure. I had to go back and *look* for Skybite. (He is in one crowd-scene, sitting in Swerve's new bar.) Meanwhile Arcee gets a shiny new body, and the obligatory show-off/intro scene. And, the Minicon/Ammonite combiner actually shows up clearly (albeit as part of an attacking mob).
Skybyte is going to be a Voyager, Voyagers don't come with comics. The cover-bearing characters aren't co-sells anymore, look at issue 8 with Tailgate and issue 9 with Whirl, those are both toys in classes without comic pack-ins. Tailgate didn't even appear in issue 8.

Next issue might be the thing that decides if I stick with TF post "Dark Cybertron".

The previews and solicits promise that somebody is going to die. It is either going to be Bumblebee, Rodimus, Magnus or Prowl.

We can rule out Bumblebee. Call me crazy, but I am not anticipating IDW killing off Hasbro's yellow cash-cow.

Rodimus and Magnus are possibilities. Both characters have more or less resolved their arcs at this point, and killing them is probably the only move that the writers could make at this point.

Additionally, Magnus' death was predicted during the Necrobot's appearance in issue 8 of "More than Meets the Eye" and it would provide a time reference/jump that TF is about due for. Magnus' death would be decisive. It would serve a purpose.


But, if IDW kills off Prowl, then.... That would probably be a clear indication that IDW was abandoning Prowl's "grey area" angle. It might even signal that IDW's TF comics were losing direction.
I've been predicting Roddy's death for a while now, he serves little purpose and his character has been waning, he's the easiest character to kill off at this point, he got shot in the Dead Universe, and now we know Megatron is captaining The Crashed Light, so seems like all signs are pointing to Rodimus getting the ol' heave-ho.

What a piece of fan-service that would be, only 20 years too late.


Anderson wrote:At this point, if they kill off "Magnus", it's not going to bother me, since he's not Magnus and the person wearing the armor has died and passed it on many times before. It's just the way it goes for the Magnuses of the IDW universe, apparently. Frankly, I'll be glad to be rid of him at this point (which is a turnaround from pre-"Stay in Light" issues).

I got the issue today but haven't had time to read it yet. Dark Cybertron feels like a bust to me. It derailed some good storylines in RID, and has taken twice as many issues as it needed to tell the story. I'll be glad to get past it. Maybe the last few chapters will change my mind. I'd like to think so. A good payoff might just make the storyline worth it.
Killing off Magnus is a challenging problem now that they've set up this "lineage of cowl-wearers" thing. Nobody really cares if Minimus Ambus lives or dies if the armor can be passed down, but then again with Tyrest dead, who will be there to pass it down? That might make an interesting storyline, but it needs far more setup than a single issue can provide.

Dark Cybertron I agree feels like a bust, it's derailed good storylines in RID indeed, and I'll add that it's shifted the focus of MTMTE too much to go back easily.
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Re: Dark Cybertron

Post by Dominic »

Shockwave's big plan is finally revealed and it's stupider than stupid, but


He wants it all....just because. Uh, that is...logical, right? Huge expensive plan to claim everything...just because.


That might make an interesting storyline, but it needs far more setup than a single issue can provide.


Your idea about Magnus would be an interesting run of comics. No need for it to be dealt with in a single issue.

Dark Cybertron I agree feels like a bust, it's derailed good storylines in RID indeed, and I'll add that it's shifted the focus of MTMTE too much to go back easily.


RiD got derailed. But, I tend to think "More than Meets the Eye" ended as it needed to. The characters were on an aimless journey together. And, now it is time for a new journey to begin.


Chapter 11:

Well, they kill off *[spoiler]Bumblebee[/spoiler] this issue. Nothing spectacular about it, but it is the most notable thing to happen. Jhiaxus getting his new, toy-accurate, body is given more attention. And....oi. The logic is actually really bad while simultaneously reconciling why he looks like Starscream.

*[spoiler]Yup, all that hype about killing the character that we can all agree is the least likely to stay dead. Well, fine. I will bite. IDW has not gone all the way whole-hog "big 2" yet. So, I will stick with the Barber/Roberts books until they bring back Bumblebee.[/spoiler]

Grade: C
Some stuff happens.

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