Hub no more, RID moves to Cartoon Network

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Hub no more, RID moves to Cartoon Network

Postby Sparky Prime » Wed Sep 17, 2014 4:15 pm

According to Deadline.com, the Hub Network is going to be undergoing a re-branding. Discovery is buying back some of the shares Hasbro owns in the channel, although Hasbro will still have a "sizable stake", and the channel will likely be renamed something like Discovery Family. Hasbro will also retain their programming from 9AM to 3PM, so it's likely the new Transformers: RID cartoon will not be effected by the changes to the network.
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Re: Hub no more

Postby Tigermegatron » Wed Sep 17, 2014 5:49 pm

This can work out good or bad depending how it all gets done.

If the rebranding lowers the exspensive tier the network is on and makes it more affordable for lower/cheaper cable/satelite/dish packages. Then this will be a positive in the rebranding.

If the new rebranding gets rid of all of those terrible 1960's,1970's,1980's,early 1990's sitcom shows the hub shows at night into the early morning and replaces them with better newer 1990's,2000's,2010's sitcom shows that the majority don't deem as outdated or garbage. then this will be a good thing.

I think the Hub networks strongest thing is all of those newer Hasbro cartoons that first aired on the Hub on Saturdays mornings. Then spread to the monday through sunday mornings time slots.

I don't like the kids themed game shows the Hub creates and airs. So if the rebranding gets rid of this,I'll be extremly happy.

While showing movies each day is a good thing. I think the Hub network does this in the over kill excessive amounts. If the rebranding can tone this down a few notches then it's another positive.

Don't care for any of the live action teen mystery shows that air on the hub. Think most of these originally air in other countries and get imported here. If the rebranding gets rid of this all together, then it's another positive from the rebranding.

Think the rebranding should get rid of most of the older 1970's,1980's,1990's cartoons the hub network airs. as their outdated and probably bring in low viewership ratings.
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Re: Hub no more

Postby JediTricks » Wed Sep 17, 2014 9:46 pm

Discovery Kids was an utter failure, it had no share of the cable pie, no share of the kid market - which isn't a terribly difficult market to tap considering the limited choices - and no real vision for where it was going. Naturally now it's going to return to that state, only adding Hasbro non-educational programming to the mix, and a brand name "Discovery" which no longer carries any weight at all.

As for Hasbro's end, they're either going to run out of programming fast or run out of interest creating programming for a timeslot that's currently dead in the water for the target audience. Seems like the home of the potato head cannot catch a break the last few years with all the things they've tried.
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Re: Hub no more

Postby Tigermegatron » Thu Sep 18, 2014 12:09 am

JediTricks wrote:Discovery Kids was an utter failure, it had no share of the cable pie, no share of the kid market - which isn't a terribly difficult market to tap considering the limited choices - and no real vision for where it was going. Naturally now it's going to return to that state, only adding Hasbro non-educational programming to the mix, and a brand name "Discovery" which no longer carries any weight at all.

As for Hasbro's end, they're either going to run out of programming fast or run out of interest creating programming for a timeslot that's currently dead in the water for the target audience. Seems like the home of the potato head cannot catch a break the last few years with all the things they've tried.


I think the Hasbro partnership with The Discovery network that created the Hub Network only existed in America. Don't think Hasbro had the liscense with Discovery to do the Hub network in other countries. Think the Discovery network still existed in other countries after the USA Hasbro Hub network thing.

Think Canada airs the newer TF cartoons like TFP-BH on another network not called the Hub. While other countries still air newer TF cartoons on the cartoon network.

Since Hasbro has contracts to air newer TF cartoons on the Cartoon Network in other countries. Think it shouldn't be too hard to re-negotiate a deal for the Cartoon Network in the USA.

About the only real think in danger in a year or Two, Is the really awesome newer cartoon shows Hasbro created on the Hub that are doing beyond great-high in ratings and have really gained a audience of young kids like the care bears, My little pony & strawberry shortcake. Think the Dicovery network would make a big mistake if they get rid of or cancel newer episodes/seasons for these cartoons. if discovery a year or two doesn't want these cartoons, it will be hard for hasbro to find a new network home in the USA for them.

As far as Rescue bots goes. The final season should wrap up and be allowed to continue before or after the Hub is disolved in america. Don't think there were plans beyond season 3 anyways. If their was don't think any other USA network would want to air this cartoon.
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Re: Hub no more

Postby Tigermegatron » Thu Sep 18, 2014 12:25 am

As far as the fate of the 2015 Rid cartoon on the disolved Hub network now discovery again goes. Think the pre-existing contracts should be in place to carry over to the Discovery again network for at least a year until season one of Rid is done airing. Problems might arise with seasons 2 & 3 of Rid, as the Discovery-again network will have the option to cancel seasons 2 or 3 based on bad ratings or newer programs they want aired instead.

Once Rid airs on the Discovery-again network in the USA for One season. then gets cancelled by discovery-again for seasons 2 or 3. No other USA Network will want to air another USA networks exclusive cartoon series half way into the series like seasons 2 or/and season 3. The discovery-again USA network might prevent this from happening per their contracts. Hasbro in the USA might have to get clever and release the Rid seasons 2 and 3 episodes with the toys, exclusive on the HTS site or exclusive on DVDs.

If Rid gets kicked off discovery ,Just hoping their isn't problems getting the newer Rid cartoons on DVD seasons or complete series, Like TF Animated had. Where Hasbro was unable to get TF Animated season 3 on Dvd for a few years. Thanks to CN owning it and refusing for a few years to sell it back to Hasbro.

Can't say I care or i'm worried about Rid's fate on the Discovery-again network. As I wasn't a fan of TF catoons returning back to the silly slap stick humor like Beast Wars, BM and TFA had. Loved TFP-BH because it was a more serious & higher kids age viewership cartoon series. Perhaps if Rid gets cancelled fast by the Discovery-again network, Maybe in 2016 Hasbro will create a more serious/more G-1 homage cartoon series on the USA Cartoon network like Combiners wars or a Generations cartoon series with more newer toys.

I have no plans to buy the 2015 Rid toys. As I don't like the TF Animated and TFP-BH design style their going for. So if the Discovery-again network cancels the cartoon series half way through, Which makes Hasbro cancel the Rid toys earlier than planned it won't affect me since I had no plans to buy the Rid toys and would of hated the Rid cartoon series.

for 2015-2016,for the newer TF Hasbro toys, The main thing I plan to buy are the Combiners Wars toys, Masterpieces and if Generations makes newer non-combiners toys in 2015-2016.
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Re: Hub no more

Postby BWprowl » Thu Sep 18, 2014 8:41 am

JediTricks wrote:As for Hasbro's end, they're either going to run out of programming fast or run out of interest creating programming for a timeslot that's currently dead in the water for the target audience. Seems like the home of the potato head cannot catch a break the last few years with all the things they've tried.

At least they are trying, I guess? And hey, that latest terrible movie still made them zillions of dollars (though it didn't sell that many toys this time...).

I daresay your ol' bugaboo of 'focus' is where Hasbro needs to go back to the drawing board. Between putting the cartoon on a premium cable channel no one really wanted to get, and releasing the toys out of synch with it and with frustrating distribution, the 'Bro almost made Transformers as a line comic-book-level-frustrating to get into and follow.

Maybe RID15 will fare better, with a line actually in-stores when the cartoon is on the air and both easier to find and follow. I coulda swore I read somewhere that RID15 would be showing on Cartoon Network, anyhow (though given CN's past treatment of both action cartoons and TF shows, that might not be a good thing).

Or maybe rethink how the line is handled entirely? That's almost an idea for a whole other thread...
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Re: Hub no more

Postby JediTricks » Thu Sep 18, 2014 2:14 pm

BWprowl wrote:
JediTricks wrote:As for Hasbro's end, they're either going to run out of programming fast or run out of interest creating programming for a timeslot that's currently dead in the water for the target audience. Seems like the home of the potato head cannot catch a break the last few years with all the things they've tried.

At least they are trying, I guess? And hey, that latest terrible movie still made them zillions of dollars (though it didn't sell that many toys this time...).

I daresay your ol' bugaboo of 'focus' is where Hasbro needs to go back to the drawing board. Between putting the cartoon on a premium cable channel no one really wanted to get, and releasing the toys out of synch with it and with frustrating distribution, the 'Bro almost made Transformers as a line comic-book-level-frustrating to get into and follow.

Maybe RID15 will fare better, with a line actually in-stores when the cartoon is on the air and both easier to find and follow. I coulda swore I read somewhere that RID15 would be showing on Cartoon Network, anyhow (though given CN's past treatment of both action cartoons and TF shows, that might not be a good thing).

Or maybe rethink how the line is handled entirely? That's almost an idea for a whole other thread...
The terrible movie made Paramount zillions of dollars, and Michael Bay zillions, but I think Hasbro doesn't take in all that much from the licensing, they get a relatively smaller piece of the pie - of course, the movie did good enough business that it's still a big pie. And the fact that Hasbro ate shit on the toy line counters that take quite a bit, if the movie doesn't sell toys, then it's not a boon to Hasbro.

Honestly, Hasbro needs to scrap the overhead and get back to the business that it made its bones with... ("textiles and stationary?" no, damn, good point, ok, the business that made them a billion bucks) toys. Hasbro is suffering from "the economy" but the reality is that the stuff they say they can't do anymore is still being done by their competitors at lower prices, and the reason is either that Hasbro has way too much overhead at management level, or their Asian contacts are fleecing them since their competitors often use the exact same factories. Quality is in the toilet while prices keep going up, that's a great way to go out of business - see Kenner's original Star Wars line, Transformers G1/2, GI Joe in the early '90s, etc..

RID15 is still headed to The Hub, or Discovery Family, or whatever it'll be called.
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Re: Hub no more

Postby BWprowl » Thu Sep 18, 2014 2:38 pm

JediTricks wrote:The terrible movie made Paramount zillions of dollars, and Michael Bay zillions, but I think Hasbro doesn't take in all that much from the licensing, they get a relatively smaller piece of the pie - of course, the movie did good enough business that it's still a big pie. And the fact that Hasbro ate shit on the toy line counters that take quite a bit, if the movie doesn't sell toys, then it's not a boon to Hasbro.

It's a learning experience, at least. It seems pretty obvious what went wrong with the AoE line (Okay, pretty much everything, but still), so I hope we won't see them make that particular mistake again... although everything we've seen already about the RID15 line makes it look like they will. Lousy long development cycles. Here's hoping they at least fix the packaging issue.

Hasbro is suffering from "the economy" but the reality is that the stuff they say they can't do anymore is still being done by their competitors at lower prices,

I dunno about that. As much issue as you seem to take with the quality (which I don't necessarily agree with; the toys are not appreciably worse now than they were ten, or even twenty years ago), I don't think I'd ever want to see Hasbro's TF line go as downhill as Mattel's DC stuff, or Bandai of America's Power Rangers; those are some truly downgraded cheapo kiddie crap. TF's standard stuff at the Generations levels looks downright magnificent next to that stuff.

(Hell, Hasbro's lower-tier stuff even set a standard for those competitors to follow; anyone else notice that BofA has 'Titan Heroes' style Power Rangers toys out now?)

A lot of this is just the caveats of the Movies propelling TF to the level of cultural institution it is now. 15 years ago it'd be unthinkable for TF toys to have product of the breadth and variety (and disparate quality) that they do now, as if they were Batman or Spider-Man or something. But today, that's just expected because of what the franchise has ballooned into. Transformers Angry Birds? That's bananas, but it happens now for the same reason there are 2 1/2 different action figure lines and three different construction-toy lines dedicated to TF being on shelves, not to mention an un-catalogue-able mass of collectible gewgaws and memorabilia you can find anywhere. Maybe in 2007 the market could support interactive TF poker chips and those idiotic Battle Master things, but nowadays Hasbro has to recognize where the peak is.
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Re: Hub no more

Postby JediTricks » Thu Sep 18, 2014 5:49 pm

BWprowl wrote:It's a learning experience, at least. It seems pretty obvious what went wrong with the AoE line (Okay, pretty much everything, but still), so I hope we won't see them make that particular mistake again... although everything we've seen already about the RID15 line makes it look like they will. Lousy long development cycles. Here's hoping they at least fix the packaging issue.
A learning experience? With every movie, Hasbro does worse and worse on the toy lines. The packaging was supposed to fix the first 3 movies' failings and instead caused a much, much bigger one which Hasbro said this summer will be repeated next year in a reverse color, IIRC.

I dunno about that. As much issue as you seem to take with the quality (which I don't necessarily agree with; the toys are not appreciably worse now than they were ten, or even twenty years ago), I don't think I'd ever want to see Hasbro's TF line go as downhill as Mattel's DC stuff, or Bandai of America's Power Rangers; those are some truly downgraded cheapo kiddie crap. TF's standard stuff at the Generations levels looks downright magnificent next to that stuff.
Totally disagree with you. I got Skids recently, the figure's plastic is so thin that it arrived in the package with stress marks all over it. Less paint apps and the paint apps are sloppier too.

Matty's DC line didn't go downhill, it started at the bottom and then rolled around for a while - you want to see downhill? Hasbro's Marvel Legends line. I can't speak to Bandai's Power Rangers now, but I remember clearly the Power Rangers of the '90s being total cheapo kiddie shit: thick plastics, exposed screws, simple joints and paint apps. LEGO continues to deliver the same quality, Mattel is able to see the difference in needs between mass retail and collector stuff, NECA continues to focus, DC Direct continues to focus on their work, Diamond Select continues to deliver straight across the board, even Mega Bloks has built a stable powerhouse of a business dedicated to ripping off another's concept.

(Hell, Hasbro's lower-tier stuff even set a standard for those competitors to follow; anyone else notice that BofA has 'Titan Heroes' style Power Rangers toys out now?)
Bank of America? :D Jumbo figures are a response to Jakks Pacific, that shithole of a manufacturer that has somehow become a top-5 toymaker thanks largely to jumbo figures in all sorts of pointless scales. So we have $30 18" figures, then Hasbro has to do $10 12" figures, Jakks does 24" figures, and I think Bandai's 31" figure might be from Jakks as well (yup, "CDI" on the box, that's Jakks' Creative Design International), and so on and so forth. I haven't seen the 12" Power Rangers figure yet, or maybe I did and it looked like all the other junk in that line lately.

A lot of this is just the caveats of the Movies propelling TF to the level of cultural institution it is now. 15 years ago it'd be unthinkable for TF toys to have product of the breadth and variety (and disparate quality) that they do now, as if they were Batman or Spider-Man or something. But today, that's just expected because of what the franchise has ballooned into. Transformers Angry Birds? That's bananas, but it happens now for the same reason there are 2 1/2 different action figure lines and three different construction-toy lines dedicated to TF being on shelves, not to mention an un-catalogue-able mass of collectible gewgaws and memorabilia you can find anywhere. Maybe in 2007 the market could support interactive TF poker chips and those idiotic Battle Master things, but nowadays Hasbro has to recognize where the peak is.
TF was doing 100 million a decade ago, I know it's as much as 5 times more since the movies but a hundred mil in sales ain't nothing. Every movie year since '07 though, sales have been down. In between movies, sales have been higher than they were in a long time, but not predictably, they ping pong wildly.

TF AB reeks of the AB brand dying and grasping at any straw they can, and since they already had a relationship with Hasbro through Star Wars, they picked that one. But TF will be propping up AB, not the other way around. The TF line seems to be spinning out of control, stabbing blindly for help.
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Re: Hub no more

Postby BWprowl » Fri Sep 19, 2014 10:13 am

JediTricks wrote:A learning experience? With every movie, Hasbro does worse and worse on the toy lines. The packaging was supposed to fix the first 3 movies' failings and instead caused a much, much bigger one which Hasbro said this summer will be repeated next year in a reverse color, IIRC.

I was referring to just the AoE line being a learning experience, I have no idea WHY they decided to try something like that after they had done pretty good with the 2007 and ROTF lines (alright ROTF took time to find its footing, but still). Like I said, I’d THINK that experience would lead them to not so that again after AoE, except like you said (and as I alluded to) they’re already primed to do so with RID15. Whoever the packaging czar is over there he must really be attached to this concept, regardless of the evidence of its failings.

Totally disagree with you. I got Skids recently, the figure's plastic is so thin that it arrived in the package with stress marks all over it. Less paint apps and the paint apps are sloppier too.

Well for one thing, Skids is a shit character so it’s no surprise he gets a shit toy. :roll: Seriously though, I’m not going to count paint apps or anything, but I know a lot of the BW stuff and on could be pretty light on paint. It wasn’t until RiD came over that they really started to get crazy with those, and even then the paint jobs were still a downgrade from their Japanese counterparts. As has been clear pretty much from day 1 though, you obsess over paint a lot more than I do.

I can't speak to Bandai's Power Rangers now, but I remember clearly the Power Rangers of the '90s being total cheapo kiddie shit: thick plastics, exposed screws, simple joints and paint apps.

That was my point, yeah. Until Hasbro’s offerings actually get down to that level, it’s hard to disparage them as much as some do.

LEGO continues to deliver the same quality,

You get what you pay for.

Mattel is able to see the difference in needs between mass retail and collector stuff,

That’s a laugh, unless by ‘needs’ you mean they know the proper lubricant to use before they bend them over and ream them. Look at Mattel’s ‘collector’ efforts: Their Watchmen line was a failure out of the gate, costing more but looking worse than Hasbro’s Marvel Legends that sell for half the price at Wal-Mart. MOTUC has always been a joke, offering average, department-store crap at premium prices through a janky webshop that they admit caters to scalpers (look at the latest Skeletor, where they just slapped a larger chest-shell over the stock body instead of sculpting a new one!). Their distribution for their retail lines is even worse than Hasbro has gotten recently. As barely as Hasbro’s keeping TF afloat at this moment, if they ran it like Mattel, it’d truly be dead in the water.

NECA continues to focus, DC Direct continues to focus on their work, Diamond Select continues to deliver straight across the board

And that one’s hardly fair. Those companies are fully collector-focused, making premium, adult-oriented figures intended to be sold through specialty retailers like comic shops (plus TRU). It’s not an all-inclusive kids-toys-but-collectors-can-get-them-too deal like Hasbro’s stuff sold at discount prices through Target. Yeah, if Hasbro was willing to sell premium figures at $40 a pop special ordered through your local comic shop, we’d probably see a jump up in the quality of those toys, but TF has NEVER been about that, so comparing it to companies and lines that are makes no sense.

This does bring to mind that the landscape for toys has changed since, say, the late 90’s/early 2000’s. The market can’t really support toys that kids can afford and ALSO cater to all the needs of collectors the way stuff like the original Marvel Legends did back in those days, which is why no other companies are doing it yet we still expect it of Hasbro for some reason. In that case, maybe that’s one way Hasbro could go back to the drawing board as it were, scrap the compromised dime-store attempt at a collector’s line that Generations is right now, and start doing specifically premium, collector-level figures sold like DC Direct’s stuff (or Bandai’s SH Figuarts or Robot Tamashii lines, look them up). You’d think the mountains of canceled and liquidated product that retail chains won’t sell or get to would be a wake-up call to Hasbro that it’s time to start doing something differently.

Bank of America? :D Jumbo figures are a response to Jakks Pacific, that shithole of a manufacturer that has somehow become a top-5 toymaker thanks largely to jumbo figures in all sorts of pointless scales. So we have $30 18" figures, then Hasbro has to do $10 12" figures, Jakks does 24" figures, and I think Bandai's 31" figure might be from Jakks as well (yup, "CDI" on the box, that's Jakks' Creative Design International), and so on and so forth. I haven't seen the 12" Power Rangers figure yet, or maybe I did and it looked like all the other junk in that line lately.

What’s really stupid is that it could ALMOST work for Bandai’s Power Rangers line; I might actually be tempted by a fuckhuge toy of one of the mecha from PR/SS (a 31” The Megazord would at least be one hell of a centerpiece for the display I have going on with the SHFs) but doing bigass versions of the Rangers instead with that staring you in the face? Dumb.

TF was doing 100 million a decade ago, I know it's as much as 5 times more since the movies but a hundred mil in sales ain't nothing. Every movie year since '07 though, sales have been down. In between movies, sales have been higher than they were in a long time, but not predictably, they ping pong wildly.

Hey, after the cash explosion that was the ’07 Movie, sales would almost HAVE to go down. We’re probably never seeing TF blow up like that again.

TF AB reeks of the AB brand dying and grasping at any straw they can, and since they already had a relationship with Hasbro through Star Wars, they picked that one. But TF will be propping up AB, not the other way around. The TF line seems to be spinning out of control, stabbing blindly for help.

Check this out: I am actually more excited for TFAB than I have been for any new TF line in the last few years. Little characteristic figures that can drive the vehicles, then transform those vehicles INTO robot bodies/armor without removing them? That’s SOMETHING, I’ve never seen that before! They look neat as hell, and for shit’s sake at least NOT like all the other transforming toys the brand has been putting out. I’m in for the first few of them at least, to see how they turn out.
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