crazy customizing and creativity questions and discussion

A general discussion forum, plus hauls and silly games.
User avatar
Dominic
Supreme-Class
Posts: 9331
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 12:55 pm
Location: Boston
Contact:

Re: crazy customizing and creativity questions and discussio

Post by Dominic »

We may as well start up the fanfic discussion here......


I am going to pick up an old thought experiment. Assume that 616 Marvel had real time pass, using 1984 as the zero point.

Current Marvel would more or less match up with the end of G1 in 1991. (And, if "Age of Ultron" plays out as expected, there might not be much happening after "1991".) The only real issue would be striking real-life references from the comics. But, those are problematic regardless of crossovers.

Assuming that 1984 is the "zero point", (where real-time and page time meet), Marvel's TF run (set roughly in real time) and 616 Marvel time (page time) would intersect roughly as follows:

1984: Autobots and Decepticons awaken. Circuit Breaker begins quest for revenge against all robots. Blackrock allies with Autobots. Marvel heroes engaged in "Secret War" on Beyonder's battle world. Savage Land destroyed. Tony Stark retakes Iron Man identity from Jim Rhodes, defeats Obidia "Iron Monger" Stane and starts the "Armor Wars". Spider-Man acquires and disposes of the alien costume. Kraven the Hunter Commits Suicide. Secret Wars II and death of the Beyonder.

1985: Autobots/Decepticon war escalates. Year of the Scourge (arguably a "real time" year). DareDevil is "Born Again". John Walker become Captain America and later USAgent. Original X-Men form X-Factor. Fall of the Mutants. Inferno. Byrne's run on "West Coast Avengers" opens with the Vision destroyed. Scarlett Witch bears children through force of delusion and has psychotic breakdown in part due to Immortus' scheming.

1986: Optimus Prime destroyed. Megatron lost. Grimlock and Ratbat take leadership roles. RAAT is formed. "Carwash of Doom". Revlon era Marvel: Executioner's Song, x-teams significantly re-organized. Peter David run on Hulk is in full swing. Various "Crossing" storylines in "Avengers". Ben Reilly returns. Los Angeles riots (as depicted in "Nomad") occur. (And, that is only one reason why including real events in comics is problematic.) Infinity Gauntlet, Infinity War and Infinity Crusade. Galactic Storm, destructiion of the Kree Empire. "Sabertooth: Deathhunt" happens, and is even more awesome.... West Coast Avengers disband and re-unite as Force Works. Rhodes becomes War Machine.

1987: Fortress Maximus's contingent arrives on Earth. Spike merges with Maximus. Professor X has a mental breakdown, contributing to the manifestation of Onslaught. Many of Earth's heroes sent to an alternate world. Rise of Zemo's first team of Thunderbolts. Earth's heroes return from alternate Earth.

1988: Optimus Prime returns as a Power Master. Starscream acquires the Underbase. Autobots engage in holding actions on Earth. Morrison's "X-Men" run, Xorn et al. Busiek's and John's "Avengers" run. Norman Osborn's children with Gwen Stacy revealed. Spider-Man is revealed as a spider-avatar....oh my....

1989: Furman's run begins. Megatron returns. Ratchet lost. Grimlock, Bumblebee, Jazz and Starscream return. Bendis begins on "Avengers", "Disassembeld". Tony Stark injecte with "Extremis" tech. Sentry returns. Superhuman "Civil War". Steve Rogers seemingly killed.

1990: Matrix Quest begins as Unicron approaches. Formation of the Neo Knights. "Civil War" ends. (Arguable, "Civil War" was published in real time, which is problematic on this listing.) Skrull Secret Invasion revealed. Normal Osborn Osborn's Dark Reign begins and ends with the Seige of Asgard. Steve Rogers returns. Death of the Sentry. (The Sentry's death could arguably be used to reconcile some of the problems inherent with setting Marvel to externally real time.) Heroic Age begins on Earth.

1991: Transformers and Neo Knights leave Earth to battle Unicron. Grimlock returns with nucleon, creating Action Masters. Ark (re)crashes on Earth, Galvatron is defeated by Fortress Maximus. Decepticon army broken on Klo. Avengers and X-Men battle over Phoenix force. Kaine takes mantle of new Scarlet Spider. ???????????


And, if we use the IDW/Marvel cross-over, 2006 would be the zero point.



Dom
-notes that "All Hail Megatron" would have been a much different story set in 616 Marvel.
User avatar
Gomess
Supreme-Class
Posts: 2767
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:10 am
Location: Eng-er-land

Re: crazy customizing and creativity questions and discussio

Post by Gomess »

I don't do Marvel, but I do do inter-thread conversations!

So why is the story you've been discussing with me different to the scourge you call fanfic?

Like I said in the other thread, I assume it's because you seriously intend to get it published, while you assume no Fanfic Writers do. Because many of them do intend to and get published- Fifty Shades- while your story is, until it *is* published... a story created with an existing IP. Fanfic.

Perhaps you just conflate "fanfic" with "low quality," and wouldn't even refer to good fanfic (you have admitted it exists) as "fanfic"...?
COME TO TFVIEWS oh you already did
User avatar
Dominic
Supreme-Class
Posts: 9331
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 12:55 pm
Location: Boston
Contact:

Re: crazy customizing and creativity questions and discussio

Post by Dominic »

Fanfic is unofficial content. That is why I get annoyed when people dismiss Fun Publications as fanfic. (It is official. That is not open to dispute.)
Like I said in the other thread, I assume it's because you seriously intend to get it published, while you assume no Fanfic Writers do.
Bammo. You got it. I am writing something that I have some intent to submit to a real editor and (hopefully) getting legitimately published. Granted, those are long odds. But, that is my plan.


Dom
User avatar
BWprowl
Supreme-Class
Posts: 4145
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:15 pm
Location: Shelfwarming, because of Shellforming
Contact:

Re: crazy customizing and creativity questions and discussio

Post by BWprowl »

See, my thing is, you're currently working on figuring out a tabletop roleplaying-game system based on PCC. Why are you doing that? For funsies, basically. Because it's entertaining and fulfilling to generate something of your own, possibly to share with others, based on a property you enjoy. I guess I don't see how that's so different from people writing their own stories in a setting they're familiar with and fond of because it entertains them.

It also seems that 'writing for recreation' isn't a thing for you, but writing, just for kicks, is something a lot of people do for fun, intent to publish/profit be damned. And I'd hope that you wouldn't be so full of yourself that you'd want to dictate what others could and couldn't do for *fun*.
Gom wrote:Like I said in the other thread, I assume it's because you seriously intend to get it published, while you assume no Fanfic Writers do. Because many of them do intend to and get published- Fifty Shades- while your story is, until it *is* published... a story created with an existing IP. Fanfic.
Oh god, you somehow reminded me that Sword Art Online, which has me almost completely losing faith in the taste of anime fans today, began as a fanfic some kid wrote about the MMO he was playing at the time and posted to 2ch. It's ridiculous what these things can grow out of.

Might pull out that fanfic tonight...
Image
User avatar
Gomess
Supreme-Class
Posts: 2767
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:10 am
Location: Eng-er-land

Re: crazy customizing and creativity questions and discussio

Post by Gomess »

But loads of fanfic writers create stories to be published. Not the majority, of course, since it's mostly a personal- or in some cases, social- exercise that makes use of emerging media, and most fanficcers probably never look back once they got whatever they needed from doing it.

But those that do... like the aforementioned Fiddy Shady, and the abominably designed Sword Art Online... what of them? Not fanfic, because they either wanted it to get published, or regarldess of intention it ended up getting published...?

'Cos I think we're dealing with semantics, and that's probably why everyone is like DOM WHAT'S WRONG WITH FANFIC because everyone else's definition is different to yours. The curse of tone being lost over the internet?

Oh, wait, I got it- is it because you haven't put your story online for public viewing, so it *feels* more professional?

Heh, we really should start a Coming Out thread where we all post the deepest darkest secrets of our TF- or whatever- fanfic. I still have all the scripts for my comics, though the art would have to be rescanned, so meh.
COME TO TFVIEWS oh you already did
User avatar
BWprowl
Supreme-Class
Posts: 4145
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:15 pm
Location: Shelfwarming, because of Shellforming
Contact:

Re: crazy customizing and creativity questions and discussio

Post by BWprowl »

Gomess wrote:But those that do... like the aforementioned Fiddy Shady, and the abominably designed Sword Art Online...
But Asuna loves you for exactly who you are and would never try to change you or tell you you're playing video games too much in fact she plays video games with you and is totally impressed at how good you are at them and is totally loyal and faithful to you and-urgh, *puke*.
(I could at least understand the modern otaku's fixation on Asuna a bit more if her *design* was moderately interesting, but she's so...generic. Bland.)
Dom wrote:Bammo. You got it. I am writing something that I have some intent to submit to a real editor and (hopefully) getting legitimately published. Granted, those are long odds. But, that is my plan.
Maybe it's just me, but I find very cynical the view that "You should never create anything ever unless you plan to market and profit from it!". I mean, I know we live in a capitalist society (most of us, sorry Gomess), but I don't see why that should limit the hows and whys of what we do for fun, or to unwind. I had a whole Negima fanfic I wrote just because I had the spark and wanted to get it out of my system, and I didn't even post it online until my brother happened upon it while he was using my computer to do homework and told me I should put it out there.
Image
User avatar
andersonh1
Moderator
Posts: 6323
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2008 3:22 pm
Location: South Carolina

Re: crazy customizing and creativity questions and discussio

Post by andersonh1 »

I might have had a shot at getting published at one point, as part of a group. One of the Mosaic writers had Chris Ryall's ear somehow, and he was trying to recruit some people to write and draw a post Beast Machines comic with the hopes of getting it picked up by IDW. He didn't have at all the same ideas or character directions as I did, but he was happy to have me on board to do some writing since I was interested. And along with one other writer, we started working on scripts and had a number of issues written. Ryall actually came to take a look at one point, but he was expecting finished comics, and we had trouble recruiting and keeping artists, so the project stalled and then just sort of ended. I haven't talked to the other two writers for some years.

It would have been an interesting collaborative project for me, since some of the ideas that other two writers had differed quite a bit from what I thought should happen. Alas, it didn't happen.

And then of course I was involved with drawing several of the Mosaic pieces, but I had no desire or expectation of parlaying that into any professional work. I've always enjoyed drawing, but I'm a long way from having talent at the level needed to be a professional artist. I just enjoyed being a part of that project.
User avatar
Gomess
Supreme-Class
Posts: 2767
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:10 am
Location: Eng-er-land

Re: crazy customizing and creativity questions and discussio

Post by Gomess »

Conversations like this make me wonder if we wouldn't have had a go at creating a TF comic as a forum a few years back, when we were all RiD2 crazy and before we all sprouted new responsibilities.

It's interesting to imagine what we'd come up with all together, with such a variety of backgrounds, ambitions, and the fact that I think only around three of us care to draw.
COME TO TFVIEWS oh you already did
User avatar
Dominic
Supreme-Class
Posts: 9331
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 12:55 pm
Location: Boston
Contact:

Re: crazy customizing and creativity questions and discussio

Post by Dominic »

But loads of fanfic writers create stories to be published. Not the majority, of course, since it's mostly a personal- or in some cases, social- exercise that makes use of emerging media, and most fanficcers probably never look back once they got whatever they needed from doing it.
The idea is that if somebody is writing something with the intent of getting it *legitimately* published, then it is not fanfic. It is an attempt at getting published.

I have a half dozen or so scripts for short TF stories that are never going anywhere because IDW killed "Mosaic". The whole point of that was for fans to get their work out there in a semi-official forum where it was all but guaranteed to be looked at by people who matter at Hasbro and IDW. But, that is not an option. And, IDW is not supporting that sort of thing at this point. So, those stories (inluding "Unicron v/s the Death Star") are never going to happen.

Yes, I have an idea for a "Mega-Man" story. But, I am not posting about it at large because if I actually write it, I want to use it to break in to comics through Archie some other other legitimate license holder.

And, even that game I am (sort of) working on is something that I would like to pitch to Hasbro.


Dom
-figures mock character profiles are about as much fanfic as is worth writing.
User avatar
Gomess
Supreme-Class
Posts: 2767
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:10 am
Location: Eng-er-land

Re: crazy customizing and creativity questions and discussio

Post by Gomess »

We place a different value on "publishing" then. In the purest sense, what is the difference between getting published in Archie and having your work be one of the most celebrated pieces on fanfiction.net? Certainly not audience numbers. Money?

As someone who has had both fiction and non-fiction published, I can tell you I personally draw no inherent satisfaction from it. For me, what's important is what kind of conversations grow out of the things I create, between me and those I share it with- whether those people number in the thousands, or just a few friends, is irrelevant to me.
COME TO TFVIEWS oh you already did
Post Reply